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[20:59]<svjgncdlxnz>so even though I would singlehandedly resurrect and extend it, since the workload would be lower than starting over
[20:59]<svjgncdlxnz>instead i'm starting over
[20:59]<svjgncdlxnz>because it uses a destructive license
[20:59]<svjgncdlxnz>and therefore all that work is just thrown away
[20:59]<wysxcrx>well, as I said, Stallman is dogmatic, he's trying to make the world a better place, rather than solve this problem right here and right now
[20:59]<svjgncdlxnz>he's failing
[20:59]<svjgncdlxnz>miserably
[20:59]<svjgncdlxnz>he's making the world a far worse place
[20:59]<wysxcrx>or what he thinks is a 'better place'
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>i don't care what the reason for his dogma is; making choices based on dogma instead of looking at the real world effects of one's choices is religion
[21:00]<wysxcrx>well, I don't think it's that obvious. who knows if we had the kind of open-source and free-software movement these days without him. I guess not.
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>and religion does not belong in software
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>neither does stallman
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>uh
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>okay
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>you keep saying "it's not that obvious"
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>can you give me even one example of where the GCC has actually helped someone
[21:00]<wysxcrx>because you keep saying 'it's like this and it's like that'
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>yeah, i'm also giving examples and reasoning
[21:00]<wysxcrx>you cut the world into black and white, and it isn't
[21:00]<svjgncdlxnz>can you give me even one example of where the GCC has actually helped someone
[21:01]<svjgncdlxnz>just one
[21:01]<svjgncdlxnz>because i can give you several hundred examples of where it's done major damage to various projects
[21:01]<wysxcrx>the linux kernel development?
[21:01]<svjgncdlxnz>how has the GPL assisted kernel development
[21:01]<wysxcrx>the gcc has
[21:01]<svjgncdlxnz>let's try this again
[21:01]<svjgncdlxnz>can you give me even one example of where the GPL has actually helped someone <-- sorry, brain fart
[21:01]<wysxcrx>and I'm pretty sure ppl like Cox wouln't have contributed if the licence woulnd't have been a gpl-like one
[21:01]<svjgncdlxnz>uh
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>cox was contributing to gcc before the gpl existed
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>and his contributions aren't all that important besides
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>don't set up temples to non-gods
[21:02]<wysxcrx>yes, under the wing of the free-software idea
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>uh huh
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>can you give me even one example of where the GPL has actually helped someone
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>just one
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>i didn't mean to say gcc before, that was an accident
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>i use gcc every day
[21:02]<wysxcrx>well, it has helped me, because it keeps everything nice and open source
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>uh
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>no
[21:02]<svjgncdlxnz>it keeps it fake-open
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>i can't use or contribute to any of your work
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>and there's no reason other licenses wouldn't give you the same
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>let's try this yet again
[21:03]<wysxcrx>sure you can
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>"helped" doesn't mean "was there"
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>no i can't
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>the way nintendo's NDAs are written - which is the norm in the real world - prevents it
[21:03]<wysxcrx>if I write program A and put it under gpl, you can take it and cahnge it and distribute it as product B
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>how has the GPL given you aid
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>no
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>i can't
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>because i have to redistribute the core code
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>and my NDAs prevent that
[21:03]<svjgncdlxnz>which is the norm in the real world
[21:03]<wysxcrx>what NDA?
[21:04]<svjgncdlxnz>jfc
[21:04]<svjgncdlxnz>can you please answer the question
[21:04]<svjgncdlxnz>what aid has GPL ever given to you that you couldn't have gotten from a real open source license please
[21:04]<svjgncdlxnz>"it keeps my things open source, and we'll just ignore that they would have been that way without the gpl too"
[21:05]<svjgncdlxnz>anything?
[21:05]<wysxcrx>okay, I guess you got a point
[21:05]<svjgncdlxnz>has the gpl ever done you even one bit of good, for all the damage it causes?
[21:05]<svjgncdlxnz>it's a fucking religion
[21:05]<svjgncdlxnz>the gpl is arguably the single most destructive thing in the history of open source
[21:05]<wysxcrx>I still don't understand what you mean with damage
[21:05]<svjgncdlxnz>god
[21:05]<svjgncdlxnz>okay
[21:05]<svjgncdlxnz>who do you think is the largest contributor to apache
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>1) end users
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>2) core programmers
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>3) corporations
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz><music type="text/jeopardy" />
[21:06]<wysxcrx>well, probably 3, followed by 2
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>3, 1, 2
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>now
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>if Apache was GPL
[21:06]<wysxcrx>care to give a source?
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>no
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>if Apache was GPL
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>would #3 still have happened?
[21:06]<wysxcrx>so I take this as your opiniono
[21:06]<svjgncdlxnz>no, it's not opinion
[21:07]<svjgncdlxnz>i just don't want to get distracted every fifteen seconds while i'm trying to explain something that would take 30 seconds with anyone else
[21:07]<svjgncdlxnz>nevermind
[21:07]<svjgncdlxnz>you're tremendously unpleasant
[21:07]<svjgncdlxnz>i give
[21:07]<svjgncdlxnz>"care to cite a soource in the middle of your sentence" "OMG THEN YOU MUST BE MAKING THINGS UP"
[21:07]<svjgncdlxnz>asshole
[21:08]<wysxcrx>now calm down
[21:08]<wysxcrx>I'm just not taking everythign you state for a fact
[21:08]<wysxcrx>if that makes me an asshole, so be it
[21:08]<svjgncdlxnz>you're struggling as hard as you can to prevent me from finishing a thought
[21:08]<svjgncdlxnz>and because of that, you get to languish in ignorance
[21:09]<wysxcrx>sweet
[22:17]<szgvzfznzc>How do I send my XHTML file as application/xhtml+xml?
[22:21]<grgj2jv>Do you have PHP?
[22:25]<brurxg>Erm, doesn't firefox have CSS 2.1-support?

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